Retire and Reform - rule book example

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2 years 9 months ago #5072 by Hexagoon
In the rule book, p.16 Cavalry Retire and Reform, the example shown states the cavalry unit can legally retire to Hex D. The only route to Hex D is through a forest hex.
However p19 Terrain the rule states that a unit entering a forest hex MUST stop and may move no further.
So unless I have missed something elsewhere in the rule book, the cavalry unit is unable to retire 2 hexes and therefore it may not perform a Retire and Reform and thus the infantry unit may battle it in Melee Combat.

Should the cavalry receive 2 Flags as a result of the combat, it likewise can only retreat one hex into the forest, and loses a block in lieu of the second retreat that it cannot perform.
This is my first post here, I assure you I have searched this topic but can't find a rule anywhere that allows the cavalry to move through a forest hex. What have I missed?

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2 years 9 months ago #5073 by Mark-McG
" A cavalry unit may not Retire and Reform if it cannot retire 2 hexes towards its side of the battlefield. Occupied hexes, impassable terrain and the edge of the battlefield may prevent the cavalry unit from retiring 2 hexes. Passable terrain that normally halts movement does not prevent Retire and Reform. "
www.commandsandcolors.net/napoleonics/th...ics-and-actions.html

also, passable terrain does not halt retreat either. Cavalry can retreat through a woods.

Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
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2 years 9 months ago #5074 by Hexagoon
Thank you Mark.
My printed copy is 3rdEdition and dated 2016 but does not contain that statement re passable terrain. It seems the amendment you pointed out is older but the print version was not brought up to date. I wonder how many other small changes there are, I suppose I will have to peruse the online rules carefully. Lesson learnt and thanks for the answer.

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2 years 9 months ago - 2 years 9 months ago #5075 by Mark-McG
Interesting.. the phrase was included in the original rules (2010 ed.) www.gmtgames.com/ccn/CCN-Rules-2B.pdf
So presumably it was removed in 3rd Printing and the example was relied upon to guide players. Seems like a retrograde step to me, but the rule remains the same, even if the current presentation lacks it's former clarity.

Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
[img]
Last edit: 2 years 9 months ago by Mark-McG.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Hexagoon

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2 years 9 months ago #5077 by Hexagoon
Who knows the reason. It would have been helpful to have left it in there for sure.
I have a few other, hopefully sensible, questions that are a little unclear even after quite a few games, and I am intrigued by these Tournaments. It seems you play a lot. OK to PM you, Mark? You seem like a man who knows.

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2 years 9 months ago - 2 years 9 months ago #5078 by Bayernkini

My printed copy is 3rdEdition and dated 2016 but does not contain that statement re passable terrain. It seems the amendment you pointed out is older but the print version was not brought up to date.


I assume, those passage is not really neccessary, because the passage
"Occupied hexes, impassable terrain and the edge of the battlefield may prevent the cavalry unit from retiring 2 hexes."
enumerate the situations clear, in which a retire&reform is not possible.

So in reverse, in all other situations it´s possible.

Will notice those passage, maybe i add it in the next FAQ again.

My dice are the hell!
Last edit: 2 years 9 months ago by Bayernkini.

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2 years 9 months ago #5079 by Superman
Hexagoon, I had the same question when I first starting playing this game. I simply followed the example in the picture; looks like in that case I interpreted the rule correctly. I have now played hundreds of games including every scenario in every expansion at least twice. You will find that although the rules are very well written, they are not 100% tight. You will on occasion experience a situation while playing that is not clearly covered in the rules. Sometimes the Q&A from this site helps. Other times you and your opponent will have to come up with your own fix. When I've done this, I immediately write it down so we have a reference should we encounter the same situation again in the future. We keep a copy of the Q&A from this site along with our own additions in writing easily accessible when we play.

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2 years 9 months ago #5080 by Hexagoon
Yes you are right when you take that rule in isolation, there is nothing to prevent the unit moving through woods.
It is only when you come across another rule that is absolute, and you find they are not complimentary. In this case, a unit that enters a Forest hex MUST stop. Enters, not 'retreats into', not 'moves into', not 'retires into' so enters means to go into it for any reason. No exceptions. Then it becomes debatable, which rule does one obey?
Who would be a rule writer, eh?

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