OT2019 Quarter Finals

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7 months 2 weeks ago #6351 by Mark-McG
OT2019 Quarter Finals
Scenario: 414 Grossbeeren (23 August 1813)Deadline...

OT2019 Quarter Finals

Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
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7 months 2 weeks ago - 7 months 2 weeks ago #6352 by Gileforn
Replied by Gileforn on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
Game 1

Gileforn (Prussian):10
Nemo (French): 7 (5+2)

Prussians were very good on their left flank destroyed the most part of French troops there. Then it was very diffreernt fight in the center and on the right flank. There was a a small mistake with garisson and retreat in the final but it didn't influence on the game. As a result final attack with a case to take back two anners for the majority and tropp was destroyed with a leader, banners were still at French side.

Game 2

Nemo (Prussian): 6
Gileforn (French): 10 (8+2)

French player thought taht he has a good rexult in the firts game and made many risky turns. Nemo was very god as always and punished French troops for this. The game was very and very nervous till the end. Each side can win. There where too much damaged troops with 1 block. Two attacks of the Prussian Grenadiers can changed situation to the better variant, but first combined attack on a leaders order with 8 dice on a artillery gave only one flag that was ignored taking half of the attackers on the battle back. The second attack with 6 dice on infantry gave also 1 ignored flag. So French made a final attack and finish a game.

Big tahnks to Nemo, he was very good opponent and I like too play with him again.

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File Name: Quarter1.vlog
File Size:51 KB

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File Name: Quarter12.vlog
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File Name: Quarter123.vlog
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File Name: Q21.vlog
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Last edit: 7 months 2 weeks ago by Gileforn.

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7 months 1 week ago - 7 months 1 week ago #6353 by Viridovilas
Replied by Viridovilas on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
Game 1

Viridovilas (French): 10
Soul1st (Prussian): 9

As the score clearly testifies, it was a tense battle. At the early stage of the fight, the Prussian smartly manoeuvred on their left taking control of the hills and compelling the French to completely give up its right wing. Bertrand’s army although managed to inflict a few casualties to opposing forces while falling back. In the fight, General Sur was killed in action (the third double sabres in two matches, personal note!). The battle then shifted on the Prussian right wing, where a fierce cavalry charge wiped out the left flank French artillery. But a counter charge led by General Gablenz proved able to repel back the Prussian. However, the same General Goblens light cavalry pushed itself too much forward, charging a strong Prussian artillery position that almost managed to kill the attacking unit, granting its side the final Victory point (a “Leader orders a Fall Back” tactic card played by French proved decisive, along with a Prussian attack 4d roll that didn’t score any Cav result against a 1-block unit!) The battle was finally decided in the centre, where French infantries successfully charged the Prussian hill position next to the church.

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File Name: OT19QTViri...nok.vlog
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Last edit: 7 months 1 week ago by Viridovilas.

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7 months 1 week ago - 7 months 1 week ago #6354 by Viridovilas
Replied by Viridovilas on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
RULE PROPOSAL FOR BREAKING TIES in future OT and MT tourneys (not this one, of course!)

I was just wondering how to break ties in a C&C playoff matches and I read that there are slightly different rules for Ancients and Napoleonic tourneys. In both cases, anyway, the tie-break is mainly based on the block-casualty total.

In order to give more importance to the Round Robin final ranking, I’m wondering if it could be interesting to give a slight advantage to players with the best seed, granting him the victory in any case of tie (without counting the block-casualty). Obviously the new rule might be introduced from the next tourney (for example the TGW MT4 that is starting right now, or just the C&C Ancients OT2020).

The rule should be in effect for all OT playoffs and at least for the MT Semifinals, while for the MT Finals it should be applied only if the match is played between a first seed against a second seed. What do you think?

Max aka Viridovilas
Last edit: 7 months 1 week ago by Viridovilas.

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7 months 1 week ago #6355 by Viridovilas
Replied by Viridovilas on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
AND A RULE CLARIFICATION.

Me and Twan (Soul1st) almost experienced the same situation I had had with Michal in the TGW MT4 Final. I mean a successful assault to a Victory point hex, that led both to a unit kill granting the final Vp to the attacking side and at the same time to the loss of the VPs held by the defending army (with Twan it was not the case just because after the charge he still hold 2-temporary-VP-hex Vs 1 hex hold by my army).

The question therefore regards the timing of two different rules:

The first one states that the battle ends in the instant when the last VP is scored.

The second says that a temporary VP is lost in the instant when the condition that brought to its acquisition are no more in place.

Which instant takes place earlier? During the TGW tourney we have already asked Richard Borg a clarification about that, but we didn’t receive any answer. In general, we have then ruled that both rules apply at the same time, therefore each situation simultaneously occurs (the acquisition of the final VP and the loose of any temporary VPs eventually acquired). But I think we need an official ruling for the future.

Thanks again,

Max aka Viridovilas

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7 months 1 week ago #6356 by Mark-McG
Replied by Mark-McG on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals

Viridovilas wrote: Which instant takes place earlier? During the TGW tourney we have already asked Richard Borg a clarification about that, but we didn’t receive any answer. In general, we have then ruled that both rules apply at the same time, therefore each situation simultaneously occurs (the acquisition of the final VP and the loose of any temporary VPs eventually acquired). But I think we need an official ruling for the future.


I think I've already expressed an opinion that when things happen instantaneously, they are simultaneous.

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7 months 1 week ago #6357 by Mark-McG
Replied by Mark-McG on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals

Viridovilas wrote: RULE PROPOSAL FOR BREAKING TIES in future OT and MT tourneys (not this one, of course!)

I was just wondering how to break ties in a C&C playoff matches and I read that there are slightly different rules for Ancients and Napoleonic tourneys. In both cases, anyway, the tie-break is mainly based on the block-casualty total.

In order to give more importance to the Round Robin final ranking, I’m wondering if it could be interesting to give a slight advantage to players with the best seed, granting him the victory in any case of tie (without counting the block-casualty). Obviously the new rule might be introduced from the next tourney (for example the TGW MT4 that is starting right now, or just the C&C Ancients OT2020).

The rule should be in effect for all OT playoffs and at least for the MT Semifinals, while for the MT Finals it should be applied only if the match is played between a first seed against a second seed. What do you think?

Max aka Viridovilas


I'm inclined to retain the blocks lost tie-breaker. There is no guarantee the two players will have met in the Round Robin matches, and there is no absolute guarantee that the seeding will necessarily be against equal strength opponents. For example in the decider of the 8th position, 2 players had 8.5 points from matches. On the countback, one player had faced 4 players with above average (average was 7.45) scores, whilst the other only faced 2 above average scoring players. Obviously one had a harder path than the other, yet both had the same score.

There was a tournament when a player was heading for the top 8 based on a BYE and a series of forfeit results. Fortunately that didn't eventuate.

Block losses might not be perfect, but it is at least under player control, encourages economy of your forces and maximum loss to the opponent.

Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever.
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7 months 20 hours ago - 7 months 20 hours ago #6378 by Viridovilas
Replied by Viridovilas on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
Game 2

Viridovilas (Prussian): 10
Soul1st (French): 8

The usual tough battle against Twan. In the very early stage of the battle, Prussian tried to take advantage of their left flank good position advancing uphill, but General Borstell troops were immediately repulsed by Sour light infantries. Spotlights then moved soon on the French left, were after a few artillery fire exchanges, General Lecoq launched his lancers against the Prussian line. The glorious Lecoq cavalry made some damages, but pushed itself too much forward, arriving 1-hit short from wiping out the Hessen-Homburg lancers and pushing the Prussian General himself out of the field. French cavalry was then surrounded by overwhelming Prussian forces and had no chance to get out from the trap. But French were not over yet and launched another fierce assault on their right, easily taking the hills. Only the brave resistance of Prussian infantries, coupled by a timely cavalry charge could stop General Sour. At the end, General Kraft ordered a general assault in the centre, but French immediately counterattacked generating a wild fight around the Windmill Hill, where Prussian made finally the day.

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Last edit: 7 months 20 hours ago by Viridovilas.

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7 months 12 hours ago #6379 by g1ul10
Replied by g1ul10 on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals

Mark-McG wrote: Block losses might not be perfect, but it is at least under player control, encourages economy of your forces and maximum loss to the opponent.


I agree. And having all these virtues, maybe it would be the best tie-breaker also in the preliminary round.

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6 months 4 weeks ago #6383 by Gonzo
Replied by Gonzo on topic OT2019 Quarter Finals
Game 1
Gonzo (French) 10 banners
Kandras78 (Prussian) 7 banners
Tense battle throughout. French art on left followed by bayonet charge killed Prussian art and MI, then fell back and was whittled away rest of game. Prussian range fire ineffective early, but turned brutal as game wore on. Prussian push on their left unhinged the French left with much combat over rightmost town. French had 2 town banners whole game basically. The tide looked like it had turned for Prussians at last, but last turn range fire able to kill damaged Prussian GD and LC for win. French had 5 one point units left and only 2 full point units, both FA. Prussian remaining units mostly full strength. French lost 45 blocks to Prussian 32 blocks lost. Bloody victory indeed for the Emperor. Luck varied widely for both sides, no bell curve here. Thanks to Andrajs for exciting game. I still do not know how to post a logfile.

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